Comments for ilrlo http://ilrlo.edublogs.org Just another Edublogs.org weblog Mon, 14 Apr 2008 23:25:31 -0400 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.8.2 hourly 1 Comment on ESL by tragalibro http://ilrlo.edublogs.org/2008/04/14/esl/comment-page-1/#comment-31 tragalibro Mon, 14 Apr 2008 23:25:31 +0000 http://ilrlo.edublogs.org/2008/04/14/esl/#comment-31 Dear ILRLO: Great blog in so many ways. I teach ELLs and can say that we need more teachers like you with an open mind. I really do believe students need to be caught up in their own language to have the foundation necessary to achieve higher learning. You are so perceptive to sense that. Are you sure you have never taught ELLs?? Justs kidding here. I have found that the trick with ELLs (my mentor teacher taught me this, she is fantastic) is differentiating levels of learning and separating classes by levels. That way, you can modify your lessons for each level. This ensures better student mastery of the all important standards as well. It also allows all children to focus, they are less distracted, and less prone to think of ways to behave badly! Two other suggestions for you. The tricky thing for native English speaking teachers is cultural references or background knowledge. Watch out for this, make sure your ELLs know what is going on when you refer to something outside of the lesson or the reading. The second thing that used to trip me up is when the majority of the students speak a language that excludes other children, the minority, in the class. Hope this helps, Tragalibro :) Dear ILRLO:

Great blog in so many ways. I teach ELLs and can say that we need more teachers like you with an open mind. I really do believe students need to be caught up in their own language to have the foundation necessary to achieve higher learning. You are so perceptive to sense that. Are you sure you have never taught ELLs?? Justs kidding here.

I have found that the trick with ELLs (my mentor teacher taught me this, she is fantastic) is differentiating levels of learning and separating classes by levels. That way, you can modify your lessons for each level. This ensures better student mastery of the all important standards as well. It also allows all children to focus, they are less distracted, and less prone to think of ways to behave badly!

Two other suggestions for you. The tricky thing for native English speaking teachers is cultural references or background knowledge. Watch out for this, make sure your ELLs know what is going on when you refer to something outside of the lesson or the reading. The second thing that used to trip me up is when the majority of the students speak a language that excludes other children, the minority, in the class.

Hope this helps,
Tragalibro :)

]]> Comment on ESL by c.ell http://ilrlo.edublogs.org/2008/04/14/esl/comment-page-1/#comment-30 c.ell Mon, 14 Apr 2008 22:44:26 +0000 http://ilrlo.edublogs.org/2008/04/14/esl/#comment-30 You are raising a good point, it would be wonderful if ESL students could write in their own language. If an ESL student had a strong first language both oral and written; their writing traits would become more developed. I know that this is not possible in my school district. We are mainly focused on ESL students performing in English. Due to all of the standardized tests that now dictate our student's learning, we all work feverishly to help them learn English in all areas. You are raising a good point, it would be wonderful if ESL students could write in their own language. If an ESL student had a strong first language both oral and written; their writing traits would become more developed.

I know that this is not possible in my school district. We are mainly focused on ESL students performing in English. Due to all of the standardized tests that now dictate our student’s learning, we all work feverishly to help them learn English in all areas.

]]> Comment on ESL by iltrgb http://ilrlo.edublogs.org/2008/04/14/esl/comment-page-1/#comment-29 iltrgb Mon, 14 Apr 2008 21:11:35 +0000 http://ilrlo.edublogs.org/2008/04/14/esl/#comment-29 I couldn’t agree with you more. I definitely think that teacher attitude can be the greatest factor in the success (or failure) of an ESL student. I also agree that teacher attitudes are greatly affected by our knowledge, or lack thereof. I think teachers naturally want to help people, so I think it is very frustrating when we can’t do this. At least, I know that this is true for me. I want to see all my students succeed, so it is frustrating and disheartening when I can’t help one of them. I want to learn more languages…I am certain it will make me a better teacher. I also like your idea about receiving support from a fluent speaker, but, yes, I’m not sure it is very practical. It would be nice, though. I think the most important thing is for teachers remain patient and nurturing. I can’t imagine trying to take classes in a completely foreign language…I have a hard enough time keeping up when the content is delivered in English! It is possible, though, so I think we just have to keep a positive attitude. We have an ESL program at my school, and the ESL teachers do not always speak all the languages that their students speak. They are usually quite successful. I once asked the lead ESL teacher how he manages to get through so many different language barriers, and he said with patience and a good sense of humor. Laughter and love…works every time! I couldn’t agree with you more. I definitely think that teacher attitude can be the greatest factor in the success (or failure) of an ESL student. I also agree that teacher attitudes are greatly affected by our knowledge, or lack thereof. I think teachers naturally want to help people, so I think it is very frustrating when we can’t do this. At least, I know that this is true for me. I want to see all my students succeed, so it is frustrating and disheartening when I can’t help one of them. I want to learn more languages…I am certain it will make me a better teacher. I also like your idea about receiving support from a fluent speaker, but, yes, I’m not sure it is very practical. It would be nice, though. I think the most important thing is for teachers remain patient and nurturing. I can’t imagine trying to take classes in a completely foreign language…I have a hard enough time keeping up when the content is delivered in English! It is possible, though, so I think we just have to keep a positive attitude. We have an ESL program at my school, and the ESL teachers do not always speak all the languages that their students speak. They are usually quite successful. I once asked the lead ESL teacher how he manages to get through so many different language barriers, and he said with patience and a good sense of humor. Laughter and love…works every time!

]]> Comment on Technology by tragalibro http://ilrlo.edublogs.org/2008/04/03/technology/comment-page-1/#comment-28 tragalibro Mon, 07 Apr 2008 23:12:06 +0000 http://ilrlo.edublogs.org/2008/04/03/technology/#comment-28 I share your views regarding Power Point Software and it's benefits and limitations. I feel that the criticism of Power Point leading students to over-simplify their work is a valid one. It also seems to me that much of technology can be either overly complex to use and not worth the hassle or too commercial and simple to be worth the effort of checking every single link found on a page to ensure that the students are safe while on the site. I am looking for a happy medium where I can safely lead my students to technological and literary nirvana. Anyone have any suggestions? Tragalibro I share your views regarding Power Point Software and it’s benefits and limitations. I feel that the criticism of Power Point leading students to over-simplify their work is a valid one. It also seems to me that much of technology can be either overly complex to use and not worth the hassle or too commercial and simple to be worth the effort of checking every single link found on a page to ensure that the students are safe while on the site.

I am looking for a happy medium where I can safely lead my students to technological and literary nirvana. Anyone have any suggestions?

Tragalibro

]]> Comment on Technology by royaloil http://ilrlo.edublogs.org/2008/04/03/technology/comment-page-1/#comment-27 royaloil Mon, 07 Apr 2008 21:05:57 +0000 http://ilrlo.edublogs.org/2008/04/03/technology/#comment-27 I have never really thought about the lack of kinesthetic learning when it comes to the use of technology. You raise a very valid point. Today I have been working on my computer for hours now, and I haven't moved an inch. While visual and text driven learners don't mind this kind of stagnant learning process, others would find it a terrible time. I, for one, don't mind sitting for hours, therefore I have achieved a lot in my college career, but the difficulties a high school teacher could potentially run into attempting to achieve this learning environment are intimidating. I also think about your point too iltrgb. As high school teacher, we attempt to make lessons as engaging and exciting as possible, either with technology or without, but how far is this away from the real world? Jobs don't expect you to be excited or engaged. They expect you to work. Also, in college professors don't care if you are engaged. At that point the student is in charge of whether they gain knowledge or not. The professor is in charge of failing them or not. I think your point is valid, but also flies in the face of most of the research I've studied and most of the knowledge this program has given me. That, however, should never stop us from asking these questions. Is student based learning gone overboard and disconnected students from the real world? I have never really thought about the lack of kinesthetic learning when it comes to the use of technology. You raise a very valid point. Today I have been working on my computer for hours now, and I haven’t moved an inch. While visual and text driven learners don’t mind this kind of stagnant learning process, others would find it a terrible time. I, for one, don’t mind sitting for hours, therefore I have achieved a lot in my college career, but the difficulties a high school teacher could potentially run into attempting to achieve this learning environment are intimidating.

I also think about your point too iltrgb. As high school teacher, we attempt to make lessons as engaging and exciting as possible, either with technology or without, but how far is this away from the real world? Jobs don’t expect you to be excited or engaged. They expect you to work. Also, in college professors don’t care if you are engaged. At that point the student is in charge of whether they gain knowledge or not. The professor is in charge of failing them or not.

I think your point is valid, but also flies in the face of most of the research I’ve studied and most of the knowledge this program has given me. That, however, should never stop us from asking these questions. Is student based learning gone overboard and disconnected students from the real world?

]]> Comment on Technology by grammarfan http://ilrlo.edublogs.org/2008/04/03/technology/comment-page-1/#comment-26 grammarfan Mon, 07 Apr 2008 18:51:15 +0000 http://ilrlo.edublogs.org/2008/04/03/technology/#comment-26 I agree with you about the distractions of technology. The other side of that is that school districts do their best to combat this “non-productive” use of school computers by adding more and more network blocks. From my school, I cannot access any streaming video or audio, sites that have certain words in them (especially words like “gang” or “sex,” even though they may be legitimate sources for research on controversial issues), and sites from which students can purchase essays (which is only a problem because occasionally my students use them, and in order to prove that their papers were plagiarized, I have to access the site from my home computer to print the “proof.”) There are more and more sites and features blocked every month at my school, and many of the network blocks inhibit my ability to use certain technology in my classroom. It is a shame that policing students’ use of technology ultimately hurts our ability to be effective, technologically-savvy teachers. I agree with you about the distractions of technology. The other side of that is that school districts do their best to combat this “non-productive” use of school computers by adding more and more network blocks. From my school, I cannot access any streaming video or audio, sites that have certain words in them (especially words like “gang” or “sex,” even though they may be legitimate sources for research on controversial issues), and sites from which students can purchase essays (which is only a problem because occasionally my students use them, and in order to prove that their papers were plagiarized, I have to access the site from my home computer to print the “proof.”) There are more and more sites and features blocked every month at my school, and many of the network blocks inhibit my ability to use certain technology in my classroom. It is a shame that policing students’ use of technology ultimately hurts our ability to be effective, technologically-savvy teachers.

]]> Comment on Technology by iltrgb http://ilrlo.edublogs.org/2008/04/03/technology/comment-page-1/#comment-25 iltrgb Mon, 07 Apr 2008 17:35:15 +0000 http://ilrlo.edublogs.org/2008/04/03/technology/#comment-25 I agree with you that just using technology doesn’t guarantee student interest and engagement. In my experience, I have found that students are likely to moan and grumble at a PowerPoint presentation even when it has all the bells and whistles. I also agree with you that the most effective lessons are interactive and student focused. I worry, though, that the pendulum has swung too far toward student-centered instruction (even though the pendulum hasn’t swung far enough when it comes to technology-based instruction due to a lack of access for many urban teachers and students). I know that some people would argue that this is impossible, that you can never have too much student-centered instruction, but I don’t know if a primarily student-centered pedagogy effectively prepares students for what will come after high school. I guess I would argue that the best instruction is balanced. I think that students have to learn that sometimes they will need to sit and listen to things that may not be particularly interesting to them. Especially in a college-prep classroom, and all classrooms are college-prep under No Child Left Behind, students need to learn how to learn under various conditions and in various ways. Most college classrooms are not student-centered, and I think it is our responsibility to prepare students for this fact. I’d also like to comment on your thoughts about computer use in the classroom. I agree that you have to diligently monitor students when using the computer lab because they are quick to check email and surf the web…although, I have not found monitoring in the lab to be a difficult task. I guess for me, the most difficult component of using computers is a lack of access. We only have one lab to share among all teachers, so it is hard to schedule class time for computer use. I don’t have a computer other than my teacher laptop in my classroom, so, admittedly, I don’t use computers as much as I would like to use them. I agree with you that just using technology doesn’t guarantee student interest and engagement. In my experience, I have found that students are likely to moan and grumble at a PowerPoint presentation even when it has all the bells and whistles. I also agree with you that the most effective lessons are interactive and student focused. I worry, though, that the pendulum has swung too far toward student-centered instruction (even though the pendulum hasn’t swung far enough when it comes to technology-based instruction due to a lack of access for many urban teachers and students). I know that some people would argue that this is impossible, that you can never have too much student-centered instruction, but I don’t know if a primarily student-centered pedagogy effectively prepares students for what will come after high school. I guess I would argue that the best instruction is balanced. I think that students have to learn that sometimes they will need to sit and listen to things that may not be particularly interesting to them. Especially in a college-prep classroom, and all classrooms are college-prep under No Child Left Behind, students need to learn how to learn under various conditions and in various ways. Most college classrooms are not student-centered, and I think it is our responsibility to prepare students for this fact.

I’d also like to comment on your thoughts about computer use in the classroom. I agree that you have to diligently monitor students when using the computer lab because they are quick to check email and surf the web…although, I have not found monitoring in the lab to be a difficult task. I guess for me, the most difficult component of using computers is a lack of access. We only have one lab to share among all teachers, so it is hard to schedule class time for computer use. I don’t have a computer other than my teacher laptop in my classroom, so, admittedly, I don’t use computers as much as I would like to use them.

]]> Comment on Use a Combination! Approaches to studying literature. by macnificentwriter http://ilrlo.edublogs.org/2008/03/09/use-a-combination-approaches-to-studying-literature/comment-page-1/#comment-24 macnificentwriter Mon, 24 Mar 2008 22:08:46 +0000 http://ilrlo.edublogs.org/2008/03/09/use-a-combination-approaches-to-studying-literature/#comment-24 Utopian, you ask a very good question. Do students see literature as flabby? I feel that my students feel that literature is easy and unimportant in the grand scheme of things. I am often told that my homework was not as important as their math or science or even world history assignments. The question that I end up asking myself is how can reader response theory influence a student’s opinion of a literature classroom. While other theories, such as Marxist or Feminist, seem cold they may feel rigorous to a student than reader response. They may not have the easy feeling that reader response may have but at the same time, other theories exclude the reader from the transaction. I think that the only solution is to balance the theories that students are exposed to. Utopian, you ask a very good question. Do students see literature as flabby? I feel that my students feel that literature is easy and unimportant in the grand scheme of things. I am often told that my homework was not as important as their math or science or even world history assignments. The question that I end up asking myself is how can reader response theory influence a student’s opinion of a literature classroom. While other theories, such as Marxist or Feminist, seem cold they may feel rigorous to a student than reader response. They may not have the easy feeling that reader response may have but at the same time, other theories exclude the reader from the transaction. I think that the only solution is to balance the theories that students are exposed to.

]]> Comment on Feminist Literary Theory by tragalibro http://ilrlo.edublogs.org/2008/03/23/feminist-literary-theory/comment-page-1/#comment-23 tragalibro Mon, 24 Mar 2008 19:22:13 +0000 http://ilrlo.edublogs.org/2008/03/23/feminist-literary-theory/#comment-23 Hi ilrlo: Loved your blog and it addressed a specific question I had in my own blog. I liked that you mentioned the practice of combining literary theories to extract more than one view point out of your students. I did this today to call attention to the fact that several times in Romeo and Juliet, Shakespeare uses adjectives like womanish and effeminate to describe weak males. He did create several strong female characters, as Appleman pointed out, but he still uses feminine adjectives in a negative way. My question is how do you stop these conversations from becoming a boys against the girls or us against them type situation? Cheers, Tragalibro Hi ilrlo:

Loved your blog and it addressed a specific question I had in my own blog. I liked that you mentioned the practice of combining literary theories to extract more than one view point out of your students. I did this today to call attention to the fact that several times in Romeo and Juliet, Shakespeare uses adjectives like womanish and effeminate to describe weak males. He did create several strong female characters, as Appleman pointed out, but he still uses feminine adjectives in a negative way. My question is how do you stop these conversations from becoming a boys against the girls or us against them type situation?

Cheers,
Tragalibro

]]> Comment on Feminist Literary Theory by grammarfan http://ilrlo.edublogs.org/2008/03/23/feminist-literary-theory/comment-page-1/#comment-22 grammarfan Mon, 24 Mar 2008 18:41:34 +0000 http://ilrlo.edublogs.org/2008/03/23/feminist-literary-theory/#comment-22 I am wondering whether you have approached feminist criticism with a class before. I could see my classes not responding well to the criticism. Last semester, we had a debate about gender when we read “The Wife of Bath’s Tale.” I had some boys who made some misogynist, controversial comments about women wanting to be raped. The classroom quickly exploded into a screaming match between the girls and the boys (particularly the football players). I could see them having a hard time just accepting feminist critical theory. Do you have any ideas about how you could approach it in a potentially sensitive classroom? I am wondering whether you have approached feminist criticism with a class before. I could see my classes not responding well to the criticism. Last semester, we had a debate about gender when we read “The Wife of Bath’s Tale.” I had some boys who made some misogynist, controversial comments about women wanting to be raped. The classroom quickly exploded into a screaming match between the girls and the boys (particularly the football players). I could see them having a hard time just accepting feminist critical theory. Do you have any ideas about how you could approach it in a potentially sensitive classroom?

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